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disc brake up date
http://www.ford-econoline.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=156
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Author:  red caddy [ Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:02 am ]
Post subject:  disc brake up date

Hi all, First post on this board, just needed to say hi and ask a Q. I'm retired Navy, a street rod builder and hard core drag racer, curently racing a rear engine dragster, cadillac powered, so that explains the moniker.
I recently aquired a '61 econoline pickup, but its a little different from the norm, it's got a '74 Cadillac Eldorado drive train spliced into the bed. I'm curently re-doing the subframe/unibody splice and installin' air bags to replace the mickey mouse coil over set up, now in place.
My question has to do with finding info on a front disc conversion for the stock front axle. The king pins are toast, and at the very least, will need to be re-bushed. How can I best do this conversion? Is there a "Bolt On" solution? Change spindles?
The Eldo rims are 5 on 5" and I would like to run all 4 rims the same. The Eldo is rear disc so I 'm thinkin' I will have to change the master cyl too. If I use the stock axle, I will have to run a spacer of some type on the front 'cause the Eldo rim backspace is 6.5 in. Of course, caliper clearance with the 15 in. rims should be a piece of cake, LOL.
BTW, this truck is gonna see a lot of street time, bracket racing and the occasional exhibition wheelstand pass, so the front end and brakes need to be top notch, and bullet proof.
Any and all comments, sugestions and wise cracks cheerfully accepted. Thanks, Paul

Author:  Paul L. Coffey [ Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:10 pm ]
Post subject: 

Hi Paul... Paul here. I myself have been looking at disk brake set-ups inquiring on-line using key words econoline disk & brakes. Surprisingly I found a couple of conversion companies that make brackets and use otc (over the counter) parts. One of the cleanest set-ups I found (using the 5/4-1/2) Was from a guy named Roger. He uses 3/8 flat plate bolted to the front of the spindle, picking up all fout bolt holes, Calipers to fit a 76 Chevy Nova, Rotors for a Dodge Intrepid. He didn't have an application for the 1/2" longer than stock shoulder bolts/studs, but that is what you need. The flat plate gets a 2.8 dia hole for the spindle/hub, & (4) 7/16" thru holes for the mounting. Longer grade 8 bolts needed here. The caliper mounts get 7/16"-20 threads, pre-drilled @ 25/64. All this info comes from the paper I have. The flat plate looks like a large "C" with the caliper @ the 2 o'clock position looking at the driver's side. Nice thing about this mod is: Same bracket on both sides. Look around on the net... you may find his build-up picture page. As for the bushings... www.macsautoparts.com. Jay Leno did a Olds Toranado resto-mod and had some 17 or 18" custom wheels done, similar to the Eldo if my memory serves me right. May want to check that out too.
Good Luck, Paul

Author:  Uglytruck [ Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Disc Brake Update

Paul,

I can't help you with the spacing or bolt pattern to use the Cadillac wheel but can certainly provide you with a bolt on setup for the stock Econoline axle. Everything with this kit is over the counter late model parts. Take a look at www.dddiscbrakes.com . I have one of my kits on a 62 Econo pickup, tube framed, with a blown 460 and a V-Drive in Texas.

My e-mail is dennisf@peak.org or you can call me at 541-760-2432 and I'll get back to you.

Author:  mutt [ Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:22 pm ]
Post subject: 

hi, boys....this just got psted over at ford 6 .com where I usually hang out...
http://www.carnut.com/tech/econo/econo1.html

Author:  jifop [ Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:46 pm ]
Post subject: 

mutt wrote:
hi, boys....this just got psted over at ford 6 .com where I usually hang out...
http://www.carnut.com/tech/econo/econo1.html


thanks mutt thats great!

Author:  LIVELY [ Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:49 am ]
Post subject:  disc brakes list???

new here--been researching installing disc brakes on my econoline straight axle--found this site but needing to know if this man or someone else has the template pattern and parts list for this conversion??
thanks LIVELY

Author:  jifop [ Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:48 pm ]
Post subject: 

email him at r26ford@sbcglobal.net and he'll get back to you and will send you all the information.

I was planning on doing the conversion however after much research I have some concerns about it and have since decided to get the system back to brand new stock level.

basically my issue's are effectiveness and safety.

Firstly its expensive, by the time you have all the hardware fabricated and parts purchased, changed your bearings seals etc its an expensive kit which once installed if you are still using the standard econoline master cylinder most likely wont actually be any better at stopping than a new stock setup.

The master cylinder is not designed for use with discs, you will need a proportioning valve to make it work (unless you have the 67 dual version) but even then the stock cylinder and pedal ratio will not produce enough line pressure to properly work the discs, realistically a remote brake servo would also need to be fitted to achieve anymore braking than a stock system.

Also look at a disc brake master cylinder on another vehicle, notice the remote reservoir full of brake fluid, this exists to make sure that as the discs wear that the master cylinder always has fluid in it, the econoline cylinder does not so feasibly once you pads start to wear your truck master cylinder will quickly run dry causing total brake failure. the only way to protect against this would be to change the master cylinder for a modern one. unfortunately again this is not a simple task on the early eco's, the modern form website has a section about m/c upgrades and i highly recommend reading it!

basically in my opinion unless you are prepared at the very least to sort the front end for discs and change the master cylinder for a modern one then you won't get any benefit from just changing the front brake components and potentially could be putting yourself at risk!
I also personally feel that you should add a dual circuit remote servo at the same time.

as i say this is just my opinion but i won't be changing to discs until i can afford to replace all the old components for something modern!

Author:  LIVELY [ Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:31 am ]
Post subject: 

thanks for info---i am building a 63 Ranchero gasser with an econoline axle----i am changing the master cylinder and/rearend to a quickchange/and rebuilding the front end so the new parts are ok

i have got in contact with him and he is sending the info---then i will build my own brackets from his templates[ we fab alot of parts for our rigs 8) 8) 8)
i wonder if anybody on here has done his swap and have info on how it worked afterwards???
thanks again--LIVELY

Author:  EconoUSAparts [ Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:26 pm ]
Post subject: 

Dennis,aka uglytruck, that replied to this topic once already,has the latest and greatest not to mention cheapest costing "modern" dual master cylinder conversion bracket for sale which allows for use of a remote fill master that can be used either in disc,drum,or disc / drum combination setups. No need to relocate the master like the one from the Modern Forum and nowhere near the cost. This setup is in use by many alreadywith excellent results and very simple to install. A lot of careful planning and research went into this setup before it was released to the public. Its by far the easiest setup available and as stated before the cheapest also. The bracket will accommodate a few different master cylinders to suite any preference.
The disc conversion kits from D and D are also extremely simple to install and have been proven reliable by many folks I know using the kits. Nothing wrong with Roger's setup either but you cant simply purchase his setup,you need to find a machine shop to make the bracket first ,then redrill the rotors to make it work. Dennis's kit is a direct bolt on,the ONLY kit available that is.
Dont be fooled by the TSM kits either,they are not a simple bolt on.
I can provide names of people running the D and D setup for anyone interested.

Author:  EconoUSAparts [ Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:39 pm ]
Post subject: 

I also want to add that the stock 67 master is absolutely fine to use with front disc brakes. If the fluid level concerns you,convert the lid to a remote fill setup and that issue is solved.
I read recently that the 67 dual master was actually originally designed with future disc brake applications in mind but Ford changed body styles and that never came to be.
People have been using the 67 dual with front disc brakes since the 70's at least so that issue has been put to rest. Dennis is well aware of this and more so feel free to ask him about any of your concerns.

Author:  Terry Turner [ Sat Jan 09, 2010 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  econoline front disc brakes

NOBODY yet, does a disc brake set, for early E-100's that is completly "Kosher". There are a few done but none we recommend. Before anyone worries about doing this conversion the 1st thing that needs to be done is the dual master cyl. conversion and redo all the old tired drum parts. If you have healty drums on your econoline it will stop w/ no complaints. Dont forget, the vehicle's brakes were designed to stop it w/ a load. Econoline Connection Raleigh NC (919) 231-0020

Author:  EconoUSAparts [ Sat Jan 09, 2010 2:54 pm ]
Post subject: 

Terry the D and D kit is a bolt on and has been proven to be a good one. I know several people running the setup. Jim Bulger is one of them. Im not sure if you are familiar with the setup or not but you can view it online. It's the only bolt on kit that allows you to run the stock 14" rims.
Roger Mingles setup is also a good one but not available in a kit. It uses Intrepid rotors but you have to run 15" wheels.
Im sure you are familiar with the old Mustang conversion that requires maching the spindle.
There is the AMC version too as well as the newer 2000 Mustang components that Fred Carello has done.

Author:  t-vicky [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: disc brake up date

Hi, This is Roger that posted the disc brake thingie on carnut.com Just wanted to let everyone know that my 65 master cyl (single resorvoir ) is still working good. Stops with the same petal pressure as the drum brakes. (Used an adjustable pressure valve.) Only problem in all these years is the disc is getting a soft spot in it. Very trouble free & stops great. I no longer send out the parts list & templet as it is all over the net.

Author:  EconoUSAparts [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: disc brake up date

Is this Roger Mingle?

Author:  t-vicky [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: disc brake up date

EconoUSAparts wrote:
Is this Roger Mingle?

Yes it is.

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